Base 3-4

[steelberger1]

I was just wondering if anyone here could provide me with some info that will settle an argument.

I seem to recall that for a time (late 90's?) that the Steelers were the only team that ran the 3-4 as their base defense.

Am I remembering right? I cant seem to find anything that confirms this. All I can find is that the Steelers have used the 34 the longest (since 83).

Any help would be appreciated.

[Hollywood Bags]

You are right, it was just about 5 years ago the Steelers were the only team running the 3-4.

[steelberger1]

You are right, it was just about 5 years ago the Steelers were the only team running the 3-4.

Do you know of anywhere (link to an article or something) that confirms it? I doubt that my word will be enough to convince this guy.

[BermudaSteel]

I do believe Bags' is right on that...now my proof is a little different; but I can recall using the Steelers on Madden since 94-95...the game has always had that as the Steelers base D.

I can't say we're the only ones...because I do remember the Oiler's running a 3-4 as well.

[Coryea]

You are right, it was just about 5 years ago the Steelers were the only team running the 3-4.

I think after 2001 is when teams started switching to the 3-4.

[BermudaSteel]

I found this at Wikepedia...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_football_strategy

3-4
The 3-4 defense declined in popularity over the years, but has found renewed use by modern professional and college football teams. The 3-4 defense is so named because it involves 3 down linemen and 4 linebackers. There are usually 4 defensive backs. However, most teams since the 1990s have been using the 4-3 defense, primarily because football is fundamentally a "rush first" game, and the 4-3 defense's 4 down linemen make rushing more difficult by adding that one more man up front to stuff gaps. By the same token, fast linebackers, sitting back to survey the offensive set, can key in on an inside ball carrier and "hit the gaps" quickly to offer help to the 3 down linemen when defending the rush. In pass coverage, the 4 linebackers are already in a "sitting back" position, able to see the patterns develop and cover the short/intermediate pass.

Notable teams that use the 3-4 defense are the Cleveland Browns, San Diego Chargers, Dallas Cowboys, New York Jets, New England Patriots, and Pittsburgh Steelers. The San Francisco 49ers are believed to be in the final stages of a conversion to the 3-4 defense under Head Coach Mike Nolan, now entering his third year with the team. The Arizona Cardinals are also considering a change to the 3-4 defense in the future because their head coach, Ken Whisenhunt, was a coaching assistant for the Steelers. The Cardinals already incorporate the 5-2 defense, an older variation of the 3-4, in some of their defensive schemes. The Miami Dolphins have also incorporated elements of the 3-4 defense into their scheme, under defensive coordinator Dom Capers, the Dolphins are said to run what is called a 'Hybrid 3-4' which incorporates elements of both the 3-4 and the 4-3 defense depending on the situation and personnel on the field.

With the Cowboys using the 3-4 for the first time in their history in 2005, the Chicago Bears and Washington Redskins are the only NFL teams which have never used the 3-4 as their base defense. Conversely, the Steelers have used the 3-4 as their base since 1982, the season after Pro Football Hall of Fame defensive tackle Mean Joe Greene and end L.C. Greenwood retired. Ironically, the Steelers may soon be transitioning back to the 4-3 defense in the near future, as new head coach Mike Tomlin prefers the Cover 2 (or "Tampa 2") style defense. The changes won't be immediate, though, as the Steelers did retain defensive coordinator Dick LeBeau, a mastermind of zone blitz schemes under the 3-4.

The 72 Miami Dolphins were the first team to win a Super Bowl with the 3-4 defense, going undefeated and using number 53, Bob Mathison as a down lineman or rushing linebacker. When the Raiders defeated the Philadelphia Eagles in Super Bowl XV, it marked the first Super Bowl between teams which used the 3-4 as their base defense. At least one team which used the 3-4 played in every Super Bowl between 1980 and 1993.

[t-bone]

I do believe Bags' is right on that...now my proof is a little different; but I can recall using the Steelers on Madden since 94-95...the game has always had that as the Steelers base D.

I can't say we're the only ones...because I do remember the Oiler's running a 3-4 as well.

Oilers, New England and a few others.

[FistfullofRings]

I recall it being the Steelers and Bills were the only two teams to use the 3-4, I'm not sure how long ago that was...

Oddly, during the mid to late 80's, teams not using the 3-4 were the rarity.

[Big Fella]

I remember there being a few teams in the mid-late 90s. Us, the Panthers, and one or two others. Then it was just us again before the latest stretch.

[DrunkinIrishman]

The Steelers were the main ones with a few others scattered through out. I remember when New Orleans ran it with Pat Swilling, Vaughn Johnson, Sam Mills, and Rickey Jackson. I think that was back in the early 90's. Capers was their Defensive Coordinator.

[TMC]

http://daily.nysun.com/Repository/getFiles.asp?Style=OliveXLib:ArticleToMail&Type=text/html&Path=NYS/2003/09/17&ID=Ar01400&Locale=

[deljzc]

You'd have to follow defensive coaches around.

Did Belichick run the 3-4 in Cleveland (1991-1995)? Was there a time frame maybe when Belichick and Parcells first got to New York Jets they ran the 4-3 until the personnel changed (1997 - the Farrior draft)? In 1996 I think New England (with Parcells/Belichick) was running a sort of hybrid look (I was watching the Farve superbowl and New England did some weird stuff with their defense).

I'm thinking hard and I think MAYBE in 1996-1997 would be when to look to elimiate Beilchick. Then you have to look at Dom Capers and he was head coach of Carolina during this time period (1995-1998) and I'm fairly certain he fan a 3-4 defense (Kevin Greene was there in 1996 in his LOLB spot I think).

What about 1995? Did the Oilers really play a 3-4 under Jeff Fisher (1994- )? I'm pretty sure Wade Phillips up in Buffalo was running the 4-3 with Marv Levy still.

If I was a betting man, I'm saying 1995. The only person would be Belichick in Cleveland and Parcels in New England and I think they were both not really classified as 3-4's even though those two loved their linebackers.

[deljzc]

http://daily.nysun.com/Repository/getFiles.asp?Style=OliveXLib:ArticleToMail&Type=text/html&Path=NYS/2003/09/17&ID=Ar01400&Locale=

Mabye 2000 is the year. That's before Belichick had a chance to change New England completely. Capers was out of Carolina. Parcells wasn't in the league. Even the desciples of Cowher didn't leave and take the 3-4 with them (Lebeau in Cincinnati and Hastlett in NO).

[dobre shunka]

2001 is it.

34 teams by year:

Ari: 90-91, 07
Atl: 80-82, 86-92, 02-03
Bal: 02-04
Buf: 79-00
Car: 95-98
Chi: never
Cin: 80-93, 97-99
Cle: 80-88, 05-
Dal: 05-
Den: 76-93
Det: 85-94
GB: 80-93
Hou: 02-05
Ind: 84-92
Jax: never
KC: 81-91, 93, 97-98
Mia: 77-92, 07
Min: 81-85
NE: 74-95, 00, 04-
NO: 81-94
NYG: 79-89
NYJ: 78, 85-89, 97, 00, 06-
Oak: 76-89
Phi: 77-85
Pit: 82-
SD: 83-91, 04-
SF: 82-92, 05-
Sea: 83-89
StL: 83-90
TB: 77-90
Ten: 74-89
Was: never

[titus]

2001 is it.

34 teams by year:

Ari: 90-91, 07
Atl: 80-82, 86-92, 02-03
Bal: 02-04
Buf: 79-00
Car: 95-98
Cin: 80-93, 97-99
Cle: 80-88, 05-
Dal: 05-
Den: 76-93
Det: 85-94
GB: 80-93
Hou: 02-05
Ind: 84-92
Jax: never
KC: 81-91, 93, 97-98
Mia: 77-92, 07
Min: 81-85
NE: 74-95, 00, 04-
NO: 81-94
NYG: 79-89
NYJ: 78, 85-89, 97, 00, 06-
Oak: 76-89
Phi: 77-85
Pit: 82-
SD: 83-91, 04-
SF: 82-92, 05-
Sea: 83-89
StL: 83-90
TB: 77-90
Ten: 74-89
Was: never

I only count 31

[dobre shunka]

Oops. Skipped Chicago.

Chi: never

[deljzc]

2001 is it.

34 teams by year:

Ari: 90-91, 07
Atl: 80-82, 86-92, 02-03
Bal: 02-04
Buf: 79-00
Car: 95-98
Chi: never
Cin: 80-93, 97-99
Cle: 80-88, 05-
Dal: 05-
Den: 76-93
Det: 85-94
GB: 80-93
Hou: 02-05
Ind: 84-92
Jax: never
KC: 81-91, 93, 97-98
Mia: 77-92, 07
Min: 81-85
NE: 74-95, 00, 04-
NO: 81-94
NYG: 79-89
NYJ: 78, 85-89, 97, 00, 06-
Oak: 76-89
Phi: 77-85
Pit: 82-
SD: 83-91, 04-
SF: 82-92, 05-
Sea: 83-89
StL: 83-90
TB: 77-90
Ten: 74-89
Was: never

Can I ask where you found such an obscure list like this? (Just curious, not really doubting it or anything).

[steelberger1]

Thanks for the help. That link should be sufficient, but I would like to know where the list came from.

[Milkman Dan]

Back when we were the only ones running it, we had the market cornered on draft day when it came to players perfect for the 3-4 defense. Once several other teams started using the 3-4, you saw a guy like Joey Porter go from being a 3rd round pick where we got him, to being a first rounder.

[dobre shunka]

Can I ask where you found such an obscure list like this? (Just curious, not really doubting it or anything).

Like most things, the info is out there, you just have to gather it. If you're limited to online, here's a good place to start:

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/

Here's a great read, btw, on the 34:

http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/Features/NFL+Features/2008/34defense.htm