The Ben Thread III: In 3-D

[TMC]

Has anything new happened since yesterday that I missed?

Because I can't, for the life of me, understand why some of you feel the need to keep stating your opinions/personal beliefs when NOTHING NEW HAS BEEN REPORTED. There are no new facts. No more press conferences. Sure, the lawyers talked a little but they all said what you would have expected them to...

I don't know, maybe it's just me...but I have a pretty good idea where most of the people who posted in this thread stand. In fact, I gathered that information in the LAST thread. Yet, here we are...359 posts later and we'd rather debate what it could be rather than just wait for more information to trickle in.

Like I said, this is just like the politics forum.

There are plenty of things that continue to leak. We now know that the two body guards hired by Ben Roethlisberger were off-duty police officers. That is huge. We now know that Ben has hired his own private investigators and she has hired a legal firm to represent her...and, in the words of Mike Florio of PFT (who is a lawyer), that was done because a lawsuit is coming. His advice is to find a number between $100,000 and $1M and pay her off.

[TMC]

This is just going around in circles. I've said repeatedly I'm not prejudging Ben, I said IF he assaulted her. I'm really not getting your point in saying she "knew what she was doing". What does that mean exactly, if not "she knew sex was expected of her"?

My point is, in this thread, as with Drake, the onus is being placed completely on Ben. I am sorry, if a girl meets a guy in a bar, goes from bar to bar with him, hangs all over him, has some drinks, she has to think there is some attraction. She has to think that, it is possible that he will attempt to get intimate. I mean, lets not be naive here. She has to understand that she was getting attention from the BMOC, he was dismissing girls left and right as stated by one when he asked if all she wanted as a photo. Odd how the other girl picked up on it.

I simply cannot believe that she thought he never intended on getting intimate at some time. Hell, when I was 20, and believe me, people were not as free with it as they are now, but when I was 20, if you went to a bar, met a girl, she left that bar with you and went to another, you were usually getting lucky. Good Lord, why was she going from bar to bar with him if there was no interest.

[sb26554]

There are plenty of things that continue to leak. We now know that the two body guards hired by Ben Roethlisberger were off-duty police officers. That is huge. We now know that Ben has hired his own private investigators and she has hired a legal firm to represent her...and, in the words of Mike Florio of PFT (who is a lawyer), that was done because a lawsuit is coming. His advice is to find a number between $100,000 and $1M and pay her off.

Of course, the downside to that is that, as with Michael Jackson, a lot of people (including perhaps Roger Goodell and the Rooneys) will see that as an admission of guilt, whether Ben actually did anything or not.

[Steeler B]

same crapola...lousy jokes, bad speculation from groping to rape to Ben doing the cabbage patch on the dance floor (video footage...ooooooooo exciting stuff) Next they will get the bar tenders DNA because they are running out of options.

[oneforthebus]

if a girl meets a guy in a bar, goes from bar to bar with him, hangs all over him, has some drinks, she has to think there is some attraction. She has to think that, it is possible that he will attempt to get intimate.

simply cannot believe that she thought he never intended on getting intimate at some time.

Of course. Maybe she even wanted to get intimate "at some time". That doesn't mean she necessarily wanted it to happen at that time and place.

when I was 20, if you went to a bar, met a girl, she left that bar with you and went to another, you were usually getting lucky. Good Lord, why was she going from bar to bar with him if there was no interest.

Really? It never occurred to you that maybe the girl liked you, wanted to get to know you better, maybe go out on a few dates with you, even become your girlfriend one day? Because honestly, most of the women I knew who met guys in bars at that age were thinking much more along those lines than "I hope he screws me in a dirty nightclub bathroom tonight."

[Stainless]

Maybe she simply didn't realize it was on. You can't really fault anyone for that.

[TMC]

Of course. Maybe she even wanted to get intimate "at some time". That doesn't mean she necessarily wanted it to happen at that time and place.

Agreed, but you would think that the idea of it had to have entered her mind at some point. So, IMO, if that was not the case, IF he tried something in the bathroom, she should have been screaming and raising hell. It is a packed bar, not 10 miles out in the woods.

Really? It never occurred to you that maybe the girl liked you, wanted to get to know you better, maybe go out on a few dates with you, even become your girlfriend one day? Because honestly, most of the women I knew who met guys in bars at that age were thinking much more along those lines than "I hope he screws me in a dirty nightclub bathroom tonight."

It absolutely did. But again, if you are in a public place and there is some unwanted things happening, it is not hard to let everyone know before it gets too out of hand. It was a packed public place. Yet, she left without his off-duty officers acting as body guards realizing a crime was committed. The bartenders did not know because they did not call the police. They left and found a beat cop. How could everyone miss it?

[steelerlyn1017]

Thank you and your husband both for your service.
That's a funny story and indicative of how tight military families are. Non-factual rumors are the worst hoah?

Couldn't hit closer to home than that.

[cpollock]

Of course. Maybe she even wanted to get intimate "at some time". That doesn't mean she necessarily wanted it to happen at that time and place.



Really? It never occurred to you that maybe the girl liked you, wanted to get to know you better, maybe go out on a few dates with you, even become your girlfriend one day? Because honestly, most of the women I knew who met guys in bars at that age were thinking much more along those lines than "I hope he screws me in a dirty nightclub bathroom tonight."

You know what .. IN OUR YOUNGER DAYS . some of us may have been in this type of situation .. a little alchohol , a little groping on the dance floor or at the table...you would know that if you get into a secluded area of the place the guy is going to move in .. that is why you do NOT go to a secluded spot in the bar if you don't want it to go further .. hate to say it .. but I had some encounters in the alley behind my favorite bar and I knew DAMN well what was going to happen when I went outside with the guy. Not the BEST place to have a trist .. but hell it happened and I knew it was going to happen and most of you know that I am pretty much a prude these days !!!! Young and foolish back then ..

NONE OF US KNOW WHAT actually happened ..so all we can do is speculate .. and of course .. try to remember what we did when we were in our 20's or 30's for that matter .. A time when we thought we were invincible ..

[oneforthebus]

Agreed, but you would think that the idea of it had to have entered her mind at some point. So, IMO, if that was not the case, IF he tried something in the bathroom, she should have been screaming and raising hell. It is a packed bar, not 10 miles out in the woods.



It absolutely did. But again, if you are in a public place and there is some unwanted things happening, it is not hard to let everyone know before it gets too out of hand. It was a packed public place. Yet, she left without his off-duty officers acting as body guards realizing a crime was committed. The bartenders did not know because they did not call the police. They left and found a beat cop. How could everyone miss it?

First of all, you seem to be equating "I think this guy wants to get into my pants" with "I think this guy might try and assault me". They are not the same thing. We don't usually assume if a guy wants it badly enough he's going to force us...most guys respect the woman's wishes when she tells him to stop.

Second, I would guess if this was an assault, it's a situation where maybe she was engaged in some kind of contact, just didn't want it to go further. That step further against her wishes could happen very quickly. She may have been stunned and shocked and feeling like it was somehow her fault...again, I'm not saying that's what happened, but you are assuming that since she didn't run out screaming it couldn't have happened. There is a lot of humiliation and shame in that kind of situation, I would think it's pretty common for a woman not to want to go shouting from the rooftops about it.

Ah well, much to Sean's dismay I have to leave and end this conversation. It has been enlightening for me to see the difference in perceptions betwen some of us.

[ksn6658]

My Doomsday scenario... We end up getting rid of Ben and are left stuck with Arians! I am heading to the pawn shop today to unload my gun just in case.

[steelerlyn1017]

My Doomsday scenario... We end up getting rid of Ben and are left stuck with Arians! I am heading to the pawn shop today to unload my gun just in case.

I have some extras up here...lol.

[TMC]

First of all, you seem to be equating "I think this guy wants to get into my pants" with "I think this guy might try and assault me". They are not the same thing. We don't usually assume if a guy wants it badly enough he's going to force us...most guys respect the woman's wishes when she tells him to stop.

Second, I would guess if this was an assault, it's a situation where maybe she was engaged in some kind of contact, just didn't want it to go further. That step further against her wishes could happen very quickly. She may have been stunned and shocked and feeling like it was somehow her fault...again, I'm not saying that's what happened, but you are assuming that since she didn't run out screaming it couldn't have happened. There is a lot of humiliation and shame in that kind of situation, I would think it's pretty common for a woman not to want to go shouting from the rooftops about it.

Ah well, much to Sean's dismay I have to leave and end this conversation. It has been enlightening for me to see the difference in perceptions betwen some of us.

Wait, so you are thinking that I believe that women think they are going to be assaulted? Seriously? Again, I am sorry that I believe he did not rip her clothing, rape her in a bathroom, etc. Why? Because NO ONE in the bar, the bartenders, the body guards, etc noticed she left with visible signs of rape. The officer, IF he thought she was raped, allowed Ben to leave. Not buying that. So, I think, worst case scenario, Ben touched her in a way she did not like, maybe even showed her little Ben, something along those lines.

Well, as you state in your 2nd paragraph, if it went further too quickly, she had to understand that by kissing, maybe a little touchy feel, that he may expect it to go a little further. How is he expected to know where her line is? How is that not on her?

And, for all her humiliation, she had no issue finding a cop and telling him. It is not like this came out a couple days later. She got over that humiliation quick.

I can tell you this, in my younger days, I had women do things to me in the middle of a club that embarrassed me, and I was pretty wild. But, I put myself there with those women. No one dragged me there. No one fooled me into it. When I was 20 and drank, no one poured it down my throat and everything that happened from that point forward was on me.

[The Drake]

An upstanding citizen with a perfect past that has never made any mistakes in life....just like you....right? I suppose you belong to the moral majority too.

I have never in my life been accused of sexual assault once let alone twice. So yes I am morally superior to Ben in that regard.

Actually its funny that you call it a "mistake." God sorry chick I thought you wanted me to jam my fist in you, my bad...

[CoolieMan]

I have never in my life been accused of sexual assault once let alone twice. So yes I morally superior to Ben in that regard.

but if sheep could talk, I bet you would change your tune.....

Ben has been accused...he has not been charged....right now in the eyes of the law he should be as innocent as you claim to be. you don't know jack [FILTH] about Ben's morals.....all you have are a couple of what could be totally baseless accusations...yet you are judging a man based on news reports....yep...strong moral character on your part

[ksn6658]

I have never in my life been accused of sexual assault once let alone twice. So yes I am morally superior to Ben in that regard.

Actually its funny that you call it a "mistake." God sorry chick I thought you wanted me to jam my fist in you, my bad...

Drake I had a run in with you several years ago and you tried to touch my Winkie!!!

[CoolieMan]

Drake I had a run in with you several years ago and you tried to touch my Winkie!!!

one more accusation and drake loses his moral high ground

[LeXX75]

This is really starting to crack me up now...3rd thread about blah..blah...we know nothing we guess alot..we have our thoughts on what could or might have happened ...but we know nothing..I'm done with these threads until we know something ..good or bad.

[The Drake]

but if sheep could talk, I bet you would change your tune.....

Hey that sheep knew what she was getting into wandering into my yard.

[bigtwnvin]

My Doomsday scenario... We end up getting rid of Ben and are left stuck with Arians! I am heading to the pawn shop today to unload my gun just in case.

That is a stupid reason to give up your gun. And yes I know you are kidding.:cool: