IMO we had the talent to play defense like you have to vs NE,

Burns, Cockrell, Davis all bigger guys that can press and be in their face at the LOS. Harrison and Dupree can both rush the passer, and Timmons and Shazier can blitz very well, as can Davis.
Yet we didn't even attempt to play that way, why????? We looked like we were running that ******* Tampa 2.
Hogan after the game said we knew what they'd be running

Coryea said:

Burns, Cockrell, Davis all bigger guys that can press and be in their face at the LOS. Harrison and Dupree can both rush the passer, and Timmons and Shazier can blitz very well, as can Davis.
Yet we didn't even attempt to play that way, why????? We looked like we were running that ******* Tampa 2.
Hogan after the game said we knew what they'd be running

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Butler has been on the team for all the *** beatings we've taken from them over the years...yet nothing changed, not one thing. Give the little WRs free releases off the line and let them run free down the field through our pathetic zone defense.

I'm starting to think this is a Mike Tomlin issue, Butler loves the zone blitzes, fire X blitzes, etc, how many of those did we are today? That looked like a Tampa 2 pile if ****

So.. without starting another redundant thread.. How the **** does this team get *better*?? I don't mean by make a play here, beat that team you're supposed to (that's all upper teams). I mean, better as in, they come prepared on the road. They win that extra game at home to go 7-1 or 8-0. NE is doing this and has been. They're not sitting at 10-6 and 11-5 and having to hack their way through the weeds. I don't see any teams left w/better talent and that includes defensively. Does a year really make this team *that* much better just based on experience?

Coryea said:

I'm starting to think this is a Mike Tomlin issue, Butler loves the zone blitzes, fire X blitzes, etc, how many of those did we are today? That looked like a Tampa 2 pile if ****

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Very well could be.. collectively, it was a piss poor game plan from all parties.

Steelerz99 said:

So.. without starting another redundant thread.. How the **** does this team get *better*?? I don't mean by make a play here, beat that team you're supposed to (that's all upper teams). I mean, better as in, they come prepared on the road. They win that extra game at home to go 7-1 or 8-0. NE is doing this and has been. They're not sitting at 10-6 and 11-5 and having to hack their way through the weeds. I don't see any teams left w/better talent and that includes defensively. Does a year really make this team *that* much better just based on experience?

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We have to get the 1 seed next year to have any chance at all. We also need someone to knock the patriots out in order to have a chance at making to the SB. Both are tall tasks.

The ******* players or talent doesn't mean ****, we didn't even try to get to Brady, Hargrave got there early on a 3 man rush, and I guess that meant we didn't need to blitz because we made no ******* attempt at it

I get that, but that's not necessarily making the team better. Their talent next year will be comparable, plus or minus. How DOES this team overcome the **** we see like today, Philly, Miami, BALTIMORE?

Sent from my SM-G920V using Steeler Nation mobile app

Coaching, quit coaching with your tail between your legs on the road

It isn't rocket science. Other teams play the Pats tough almost every time, like Seattle, Baltimore (not this year, but usually), Houston did, the Broncos do... We don't have the same talent that those teams do, but the scheme is the same: Press, be aggressive, and be physical. We were none of those things today.

Coryea said:

I'm starting to think this is a Mike Tomlin issue, Butler loves the zone blitzes, fire X blitzes, etc, how many of those did we are today? That looked like a Tampa 2 pile if ****

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This is still basically the Lebeau defense. Bend but don't break. It's a philosophy that works against most qbs, because most qbs lack the self discipline to take what the defense gives them, such as #7. Brady will slice up a zone all day long, as we've been seeing for the last 16 years. On 3rd down, which is always the key down for a Lebeau style defense, Brady always looks to move the chains. Other qbs too often look to make a big play. That's all it takes to get off the field. Sure, they'll make the big play once or twice, but Brady moves the chains and eventually reaches the end zone. How often do you see Brady go deep on 3rd and 2? We constantly do it, which is why we lose games we shouldn't, and why we never beat New England. 1-4 against them in the post season, with the only win the 7-6 abomination back in 97. None of the 4 losses was particularly close either. We now have some talented young guys on the corners. It's time to start playing man to man. Otherwise, we're reduced to hoping NE gets knocked off before we reach them. Neither Tomlin or Cowher would have a Lombardi if NE hadn't been upset by Denver in 2005, and the Jets in 2008.

Still there were no blitzes, Butler and LeBeaus defenses live by the blitz, there was no blitzing in this game.

Did they look at the Texan's tape of last week and say "ahh, that won't work cause they'll know that's what were going to run, probably." Lets rush 3 and drop into a zone, they'll never expect it.

Halftime adjustments: "The scheme isn't working...Lets stay with our plan, they'll never expect it."

mdk2 said:

Did they look at the Texan's tape of last week and say "ahh, that won't work cause they'll know that's what were going to run, probably." Lets rush 3 and drop into a zone, they'll never expect it.

Halftime adjustments: "The scheme isn't working...Lets stay with our plan, they'll never expect it."

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LOL, Were you in the meetings this week, I think you're correct

They're almost always in some variation of that freaking three deep shell where the corners are a mile deep and they ask too much of their LBs and safeties in coverage, especially against the Patriots whose offense revolves around throwing between the numbers.

Seriously, how many times were the Patriots able to isolate Davis, Timmons or Shazier on one of their WRs tonight? It's being outschemed and outcoached. Plain and simple.

Belichick and McDaniels ate Tomlin and Butler's lunch, forced them to the ground, opened their mouths and **** it down their throats.

Just pathetic.

Punxsutawney said:

They're almost always in some variation of that freaking three deep shell where the corners are a mile deep and they ask too much of their LBs and safeties in coverage, especially against the Patriots whose offense revolves around throwing between the numbers.

Seriously, how many times were the Patriots able to isolate Davis, Timmons or Shazier on one of their WRs tonight? It's being outschemed and outcoached. Plain and simple.

Belichick and McDaniels ate Tomlin and Butler's lunch, forced them to the ground, opened their mouths and **** it down their throats.

Just pathetic.

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Yep totally agree, rarely saw a Green Bay wr not covered by a DB in the NFC game.
Keeping 4 LBs on the field when you weren't coming after the QB was a huge mistake.

The 3-4 or hybrid 2-4 with complicated zoning schemes and zone blitzes are simply gamed out. Capers, an old steeler D.C., his defense with the pack and ours here in Pitt were defenses drug along by the teams offenses for the last few seasons. I didn't think I could have seen a worse playoff defensive effort than green bays' today till I watched a penn state lacrosse player dismantle us. Time for real change on defensive side we have great personal no excuses for this mess. Dan Quinn at Atlanta took a horrible defense and has turned around by making it simple and making match up to the offense mono n mono. Four men on the line that keep the blockers from running all over field but that can also rush the qb from the inside out, blitzing one linebacker and then basically 6 men back that can cover and tackle. Dupree is every bit the player Beasley is but Beasley had 15 sacks! And I'll bet you Beasley will be all over Brady's ***. It's a defense modeled after the old steel curtain and it's time for us to revisit it.

One of the most pathetic zone coverage's of the night (there was a lot) it was on a 3rd and 10 or 12 I believe, Hogan is literally standing in place near the sideline about 15 yards down the field and not a single person near him. I just couldn't believe how atrocious the scheme and the execution of it was.

stuntmanmike said:

The 3-4 or hybrid 2-4 with complicated zoning schemes and zone blitzes are simply gamed out. Capers, an old steeler D.C., his defense with the pack and ours here in Pitt were defenses drug along by the teams offenses for the last few seasons. I didn't think I could have seen a worse playoff defensive effort than green bays' today till I watched a penn state lacrosse player dismantle us. Time for real change on defensive side we have great personal no excuses for this mess. Dan Quinn at Atlanta took a horrible defense and has turned around by making it simple and making match up to the offense mono n mono. Four men on the line that keep the blockers from running all over field but that can also rush the qb from the inside out, blitzing one linebacker and then basically 6 men back that can cover and tackle. Dupree is every bit the player Beasley is but Beasley had 15 sacks! And I'll bet you Beasley will be all over Brady's ***. It's a defense modeled after the old steel curtain and it's time for us to revisit it.

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Falcons front 4 is built to play the patriots. They will be getting pressure, no doubt.

Coryea said:

Still there were no blitzes, Butler and LeBeaus defenses live by the blitz, there was no blitzing in this game.

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Brady usually destroys the Steeler blitz with quick throws. I can still in my dreams (nightmares) see James Farrior blitzing and Brady dropping the ball off into the gap Farrior had just vacated. Those quick, short throws are easy to make against a deep zone, not so easy against press coverage. Sure, you'll occasionally get burned playing man, but that's the risk you take.

steelermania said:

This is still basically the Lebeau defense. Bend but don't break. It's a philosophy that works against most qbs, because most qbs lack the self discipline to take what the defense gives them, such as #7. Brady will slice up a zone all day long, as we've been seeing for the last 16 years. On 3rd down, which is always the key down for a Lebeau style defense, Brady always looks to move the chains. Other qbs too often look to make a big play. That's all it takes to get off the field. Sure, they'll make the big play once or twice, but Brady moves the chains and eventually reaches the end zone. How often do you see Brady go deep on 3rd and 2? We constantly do it, which is why we lose games we shouldn't, and why we never beat New England. 1-4 against them in the post season, with the only win the 7-6 abomination back in 97. None of the 4 losses was particularly close either. We now have some talented young guys on the corners. It's time to start playing man to man. Otherwise, we're reduced to hoping NE gets knocked off before we reach them. Neither Tomlin or Cowher would have a Lombardi if NE hadn't been upset by Denver in 2005, and the Jets in 2008.

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Obviously, you cannot play man every play either, as Brady will eat that up as well. The key is enough balance to keep a super alert QB like Brady guessing.

The Steelers make it easy for him largely because he knows the Steelers are going to be in zone every ******* play.

mdk2 said:

One of the most pathetic zone coverage's of the night (there was a lot) it was on a 3rd and 10 or 12 I believe, Hogan is literally standing in place near the sideline about 15 yards down the field and not a single person near him. I just couldn't believe how atrocious the scheme and the execution of it was.

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Yep I remember that play another 3rd down where Harrison was list in coverage instead of trying to break Brady in two

steelermania said:

Brady usually destroys the Steeler blitz with quick throws. I can still in my dreams (nightmares) see James Farrior blitzing and Brady dropping the ball off into the gap Farrior had just vacated. Those quick, short throws are easy to make against a deep zone, not so easy against press coverage. Sure, you'll occasionally get burned playing man, but that's the risk you take.

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The one time we actually beat them is when we played man basically the entire game. It was Cortez Allens 1st or 2nd year and he was assigned to Gronk and did a great job. After the game, Brady said he never saw that from our defense before. That being said, the scheme was quickly thrown away and never used again.

As i wrote in the other thread, it just boggles the mind that they could go into the game with this same old gameplan. Jim ******* Nantz was even wise to the fact that if you just play zone, Brady just sits there and picks you apart.

That's right, Jim Nantz apparently did more homework on gameplanning than Butler and Tomlin.

It's almost as if the Steelers allowed Tom Brady to submite his request for what defense he'd like to face.

I feel like an idiot for being dumb enough to think that the Steelers were going to use their new athletic players, Burns, Davis, and Shazier, to be more aggressive.

Did nobody, coach or player, raise a hand during the week and ask, "hey, why are we using the same gameplan that the Pats torch every single time it's used against them?"

Maybe that's the problem right there. Are the Steeler coaches open to new ideas or do they discourage them? Some leaders are threatened by new ideas and will shut them down to keep their own authority. A confident leader wants a second opinion and is not afraid to dow something new if it's a better solution.

Reasons we lost are many. Here are a few observations from this game:

1) Tomlin and staff are simply not on the level that New England's coaching staff is and it shows. Their defense had a good plan to stop any big plays
2) Ben, again did not play his best in a road game. He had a good stretch in the 2nd quarter but overall I'd give him a C+ today. Nothing special from him.
3) Losing L. Bell hurt but it wasn't like they were using him a lot in the gameplan - more on this in a moment.
4) Sammie Coates better get an eye exam in the off-season. The guy had 3 balls hit both hands and he missed all three. I wasn't a big fan of the first drive, 3rd and 1 call but Ben put the ball on his hands on that deeper pass. He has to catch that. Should have run Bell on that 3rd and 1, especially since he picked up 9 in 2 runs and seemed to be finding holes. No momentum to start the game.
5) WR unit has to be better next year. Coates dropped several. Hamilton dropped a TD. This team needs 2 more dependable weapons in the passing game. Lots of questions with Bryant, Coates, Rogers, Ayers and a very expensive TE who can't seem to find the field.
6) Offensive play calling in this game was rather lackluster and predictable. Haley has his moments but tonight wasn't one of them. He needs to expand his game a bit.
7) Defense - Butler was taken to school just like his previous boss was. Played the same system and got the same result. Is it arrogance or ignorance?
8) Defense - New England wins on the scheme matchup. Pittsburgh cannot cover Julian Edelman with Lawrence Timmons and yet they try over and over again. We cannot cover any New England WR with James Harrison and yet we try. We fail on scheme. I'm going to say it out loud. The 3-4 zone matchup does not work against Belichek anymore. If it ever worked, that game was played prior to 1999. He's figured out how to exploit this system with this personnel package. We cannot cover WR with outside linebackers like the ones on this roster. If we want to cover WR with LB then we better start drafting smaller and faster LB. Why, why, why will the Steelers not line up in press man-to-man, and blitz Brady every play. Hit him repeatedly because when that happens he doesn't like it and can get rattled. The pretty boy can't stand contact. Sure, we give up some big plays for scores but guess what - we give up scores anyway.
9) Defense - No pressure, no pressure, no pressure all night. One reason is our DB are 10 yards off the line of scrimmage so Brady can dump the ball immediately. We don't cover the short pass and we don't get pressure. Game was lost before it was played.
10) Defense -the secondary looked lost and out of sorts many times tonight, left several completely uncovered. Maybe Butler was drunk when he put the game plan together? Were the signals not getting in correctly? Who knows but it sure looked like our defense was running different plays on the same play. Looked bad.
11) Todd Haley should never be permitted to call another play from the 1 yard line. Never. Ever.
12) 22-0. 22 touchdowns and 0 interceptions. That should be tattooed on Tomlin's and Butler's foreheads. That screams having a bad plan and then being too stubborn to change it. They have no clue how to stop Brady but they have certainly figured out what Brady likes to play against.

Frustrated like all of you but it's worse when you see a team that is so badly out-coached every time these teams match up. Even if we had better players, it's not going to matter until the scheme against the Patriots changes.

See you at the Draft.