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Defense

mdk2

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We all know the offense is terrible.

This defense is not much better. Yes, they have injuries but so does the offense. I know the MLB spot is down to the bottom of the barrel but we haven't seen a turnover by this defense in about a month. All 3 of our losses, 0 turnovers. You can't expect the offense to play perfect and not turn it over every game. At some point the defense needs to make plays too. They've had Alex Smith pick them apart, Gibson was out for Redskins and Mckissic killed them. Allen is good so it wasn't surprising to see him throw all over them. Tonight, Finley made big plays against them and they ran for 152 when they knew they were going to run.

Never thought I'd say it but Bud getting injured really hurt this defense. They should not get a pass though.. they need to make plays to get short fields for a struggling offense.
 

SteelerSask2

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No scheme. The opposition was ripe for scheme tonight. Mike Tomlin believed they should play safe because their offense should be good enough to win. Mike Tomlin has always and always will fear the big play. He would rather die by a thousand cuts then bring an all pro safety down where he can make a play.
 

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The Bengals with a QB who has never won an NFL game and has a career passer rating of 18.7 ran 41 times for 152 yards. he idiot Tomlin plays a small converted safety at ILB instead of stacking the line and daring a bad QB to beat them . Did he , hell no, he took it up the *** from the Bengals and Finley. its no wonder Tomlin again adds to his record of losing to sub .200 winning percentage teams.
 

SteelerFan448

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Bengals knew that the Steelers don’t hold the edge. They’re aggressive because they’re always going downhill attacking the QB. All they had to do was play to stop the run first and let Finley try to beat them through the air.
 

topseed

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We all know the offense is terrible.

This defense is not much better. Yes, they have injuries but so does the offense. I know the MLB spot is down to the bottom of the barrel but we haven't seen a turnover by this defense in about a month. All 3 of our losses, 0 turnovers. You can't expect the offense to play perfect and not turn it over every game. At some point the defense needs to make plays too. They've had Alex Smith pick them apart, Gibson was out for Redskins and Mckissic killed them. Allen is good so it wasn't surprising to see him throw all over them. Tonight, Finley made big plays against them and they ran for 152 when they knew they were going to run.

Never thought I'd say it but Bud getting injured really hurt this defense. They should not get a pass though.. they need to make plays to get short fields for a struggling offense.

The main issue with the defense has been injuries at linebacker, and secondarily, poor scheme.

But as far as last night's game, the offense not only didn't play perfectly, but it was also one of the worst halves of offensive football I have ever seen. These were the Steelers first half "drives":

1) 3 plays, 2 yards, punt
2) 3 plays, 4 yards. punt
3) 1 play, 0 yards, Ben fumbles on the Steelers' 20 yard line
4) 3 plays, 3 yards, punt
5) 3 plays, -7 yards, JuJu fumbles on the Steelers' 38 yard line

(At this point, about one third of the way through the contest, the offense has compiled a grand total of 2 yards on 13 plays from scrimmage, and it's still a 3-0 game.)

6) 10 plays, 17 yards, Ben throws a pick returned the Steelers' 41, tack 15 yards on because of a moronic late hit by Okorafor, Bengals ball at the 26
7) 3 plays, 7 yards, punt
8) 3 plays, 4 yards, punt

(The Steelers end the half having gained 30 yards on 29 plays, aided by a meaningless 12-yard completion to Samuels on a 3rd-and-18 on their final offensive snap.)

You cannot expect this defense (or any defense) to hold this opponent (or any NFL opponent) back when the Steelers' simply could not sustain any semblance of a drive and handed the ball over three times inside their own 40 yard line. They got tired from constantly being put back out on the field with no help whatsoever from the offense. The defense only allowed 117 yards in the first half, and it was still 17-0. Not their fault at all.
 

SteelerSask2

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Yes but the drive when the score was 17-10 was totally their fault. And the first down with 5 minutes left on the ground which put the offense behind the 8 ball on the final drive most certainly was.
 

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Yes but the drive when the score was 17-10 was totally their fault. And the first down with 5 minutes left on the ground which put the offense behind the 8 ball on the final drive most certainly was.

Can't look at those situations in a vacuum. You're sounding as if you believe the Defense was fresh when those things happened. I submit that after being hung out to dry by the Offense and staying on the field for a majority of the first half, they were simply tired. And that result is directly attributable to the Offense not being able to play complementary football and give them a breather of any sort until into the 3rd Quarter.
There's not a Defense out there that could spend the amount of time on the field that our Defense has been required to for the last 4 or 5 games and not start to show the effects. Add in the injuries and there ya go. The Defense forced several 3 and outs during the game. That should have helped the Offense. What did the Offense do to help the D? Complementary football
 

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Losing some of the guys who get their names called on big plays by the defense to injury this year has really hurt. However, I NEVER hear them call Edmunds name for big plays. Is it good or bad to be a safety who goes un noticed? Guess I got spoiled by Polamalu.
 

mdk2

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The main issue with the defense has been injuries at linebacker, and secondarily, poor scheme.

But as far as last night's game, the offense not only didn't play perfectly, but it was also one of the worst halves of offensive football I have ever seen. These were the Steelers first half "drives":

1) 3 plays, 2 yards, punt
2) 3 plays, 4 yards. punt
3) 1 play, 0 yards, Ben fumbles on the Steelers' 20 yard line
4) 3 plays, 3 yards, punt
5) 3 plays, -7 yards, JuJu fumbles on the Steelers' 38 yard line

(At this point, about one third of the way through the contest, the offense has compiled a grand total of 2 yards on 13 plays from scrimmage, and it's still a 3-0 game.)

6) 10 plays, 17 yards, Ben throws a pick returned the Steelers' 41, tack 15 yards on because of a moronic late hit by Okorafor, Bengals ball at the 26
7) 3 plays, 7 yards, punt
8) 3 plays, 4 yards, punt

(The Steelers end the half having gained 30 yards on 29 plays, aided by a meaningless 12-yard completion to Samuels on a 3rd-and-18 on their final offensive snap.)

You cannot expect this defense (or any defense) to hold this opponent (or any NFL opponent) back when the Steelers' simply could not sustain any semblance of a drive and handed the ball over three times inside their own 40 yard line. They got tired from constantly being put back out on the field with no help whatsoever from the offense. The defense only allowed 117 yards in the first half, and it was still 17-0. Not their fault at all.

They couldnt stop Ryan Finley and they couldn’t stop Alex Smith. They couldn’t get 1 turnover to change the momentum of the game, not one time. Yes, they absolutely hold some fault in this **** show.


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mdk2

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Can't look at those situations in a vacuum. You're sounding as if you believe the Defense was fresh when those things happened. I submit that after being hung out to dry by the Offense and staying on the field for a majority of the first half, they were simply tired. And that result is directly attributable to the Offense not being able to play complementary football and give them a breather of any sort until into the 3rd Quarter.
There's not a Defense out there that could spend the amount of time on the field that our Defense has been required to for the last 4 or 5 games and not start to show the effects. Add in the injuries and there ya go. The Defense forced several 3 and outs during the game. That should have helped the Offense. What did the Offense do to help the D? Complementary football

The time of possession was basically equal. That’s garbage that they’re too tired to stop a horrible offense, they couldn’t hold them to FGs multiple times. How about they get a single turnover, just one. Nope couldn’t do it. Haven’t done it in weeks.. they’re suppose to be a great defense, you need to stop these **** offenses and atleast hold them to FGs. Maybe a get a turnover once in a while too.


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Ike Kelly

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Losing some of the guys who get their names called on big plays by the defense to injury this year has really hurt. However, I NEVER hear them call Edmunds name for big plays. Is it good or bad to be a safety who goes un noticed? Guess I got spoiled by Polamalu.

Most likely. Darren Perry rarely had his name called and he was a stalwart for seven years from starting over 100+ games including his rookie year. Mike Wagner and Glen Edwards were definitely underrated during their decade.


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SteelBuckeye

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Losing some of the guys who get their names called on big plays by the defense to injury this year has really hurt. However, I NEVER hear them call Edmunds name for big plays. Is it good or bad to be a safety who goes un noticed? Guess I got spoiled by Polamalu.

Let's see. Edmunds is second on the team with 64 combined tackles (44 solo/20 assists) - Minkah leads the team with 66 combined tackles. Edmunds is also tied for second with Haden, Hilton and Nelson with 2 INTs - Minkah is first with 4. Throw in a sack and he's having a pretty good year. Minkah made the Pro Bowl with similar stats. I think there's built in bias against Edmunds and, like Bud, you won't know what you had until he's gone. Not every first round pick will be a star. But, if you're not a star, there's worse things you could be known other than steady and developing in year 3.

Edit: Link to stats

http://https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/pit/2020.htm
 
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Steel G

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Yes but the drive when the score was 17-10 was totally their fault. And the first down with 5 minutes left on the ground which put the offense behind the 8 ball on the final drive most certainly was.

Yeah, but the offense's drive down 17-10 at the end of the third quarter amassed just 7 yards on 3 plays. Right when they needed at least 3 points.The defense was ****** by the offense in that game. Even if the D stacked the box, the Bungles were not throwing anything substaional with two double digit leads, there was no need to. That first half was the worst half of offensive football I've ever seen in my 40+ years.
 

SteelBuckeye

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The time of possession was basically equal. That’s garbage that they’re too tired to stop a horrible offense, they couldn’t hold them to FGs multiple times. How about they get a single turnover, just one. Nope couldn’t do it. Haven’t done it in weeks.. they’re suppose to be a great defense, you need to stop these **** offenses and atleast hold them to FGs. Maybe a get a turnover once in a while too.


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Injuries play a part. You're expecting the same level of play as if they had Bud, Vince and Bush in there. You're not going to get that. And if you don't think being hung out to dry multiple games in a row has a lasting impact on whether a Defense gets worn down over time, I don't know what to tell you. I didn't just reference last night's game. The Offense has been offensive for the last 4 - 5 weeks. The Defense is what carried them for at least a couple of weeks before the losing streak. And yes, they're injured and worn out. Sucks. But it also sucks that the Offense is so damn inept that they can't pick up more than 1 first down in a whole half.

Between the two units, Offense and Defense, which one has at least looked like it's even remotely capable for the last few weeks? Sure as hell isn't the Offense.
 

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Yeah, the Defense didn't play well at times during the game and letting Finley run free was stupid. The multiple injuries at LB have really hurt us. Still, I think the D played well enough to win if the O had even had a mediocre game but not good enough to overcome all the turnovers and terrible field position they had to face due to the ineptitude of the offense. I'm not concerned about the defense going forward, especially if we get Vince back at ILB. The offense on the other hand..........
 

mdk2

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Injuries play a part. You're expecting the same level of play as if they had Bud, Vince and Bush in there. You're not going to get that. And if you don't think being hung out to dry multiple games in a row has a lasting impact on whether a Defense gets worn down over time, I don't know what to tell you. I didn't just reference last night's game. The Offense has been offensive for the last 4 - 5 weeks. The Defense is what carried them for at least a couple of weeks before the losing streak. And yes, they're injured and worn out. Sucks. But it also sucks that the Offense is so damn inept that they can't pick up more than 1 first down in a whole half.

Between the two units, Offense and Defense, which one has at least looked like it's even remotely capable for the last few weeks? Sure as hell isn't the Offense.

My whole point is that both units are bad. Sure, the defense is less bad but they should not be given a free pass when you consider these QBs they’ve faced in 2 of 3 weeks. They need to help the offense with getting a turnover a time or two.


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My whole point is that both units are bad. Sure, the defense is less bad but they should not be given a free pass when you consider these QBs they’ve faced in 2 of 3 weeks. They need to help the offense with getting a turnover a time or two.


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I get what you're saying. But, I'm seeing an injured unit still out there fighting. I see little to no fight from the Offense. And, the Offense could help itself by not turning the ball over themselves and catching the balls that are thrown their way, I will say that their have been signs of life in the last two games. Just not enough to win and overcome the stupid **** they've been doing.
 

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Yes but the drive when the score was 17-10 was totally their fault. And the first down with 5 minutes left on the ground which put the offense behind the 8 ball on the final drive most certainly was.

That's where the faulty scheme hurt the D greatly, yes. Along with the poor play diagnosis from Fitzpatrick on the touchdown, which I think you mentioned in another thread. But anyone with eyeballs could see that they were still able to overcome the poor defensive game plan in the first and third quarters, when they were fresh.
 

Coryea

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Bengals were using their 3rd QB, starting rb didn't play, and their best wr got hurt very early, and their Oline has been trash, there is zero excuse for our defense to allow them to score 3 TDs

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topseed

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They couldnt stop Ryan Finley and they couldn’t stop Alex Smith. They couldn’t get 1 turnover to change the momentum of the game, not one time. Yes, they absolutely hold some fault in this **** show.
Wasn't talking about Alex Smith and the Redskins game here, but that is, coincidentally, another story of the Steelers offense disappearing for another full half, when they scored a total of 3 points after halftime of that contest.

As far as not stopping Ryan Finley -- he completed 7 passes for 89 yards. In the entire game. The mistake they made was not adjusting to Cincinnati's obvious plan to run the football. You have to force the third string quarterback to throw the ball to beat you. They gave up 150+ yards to one of the worst rushing offenses in the league. That's unacceptable, and that's mostly on Tomlin and the coaching staff.
 

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They couldnt stop Ryan Finley and they couldn’t stop Alex Smith. They couldn’t get 1 turnover to change the momentum of the game, not one time. Yes, they absolutely hold some fault in this **** show.


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You cant compare Ryan Finley to Alex Smith.....Finley had like 90 yrds passing and completed 7 passes I think they did a good job of stopping him. What they did not do was play the proper defense. They should have bailed out to stop the run. If Finley started playing well then adjust. They played defense like Finley was Mahomes. Just not smart football at all
 

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My whole point is that both units are bad. Sure, the defense is less bad but they should not be given a free pass when you consider these QBs they’ve faced in 2 of 3 weeks. They need to help the offense with getting a turnover a time or two.

Makes it a tad more difficult to get a turnover when your opponent only has to pass the ball 13 times, doesn't it? 4 out of the 5 scoring drives by the Bengals were 38 yards or less. 2 of those were less than 10 yards.

No one is giving the defense a free pass, but if you don't think they are being physically and mentally drained by entire halves when the offense does next to nothing while giving the opposing team points and/or short fields, you're not paying attention.
 

Coryea

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Defense wasn't gassed that quick, Bengals scored two tds in the first half, they are allowed to make them kick a fg

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topseed

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Defense wasn't gassed that quick, Bengals scored two tds in the first half, they are allowed to make them kick a fg

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They did make the Bengals kick a field goal. Right after Ben fumbled the snap on his own 20 yard line. Remember?

Then they gave up the two touchdowns after Cincinnati only had to move the ball 38 and 26 yards, thanks to Ben getting JuJu lit up on a hopeless 3rd down pass, and a Ben interception.

See a theme there?
 

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Defense wasn't gassed that quick, Bengals scored two tds in the first half, they are allowed to make them kick a fg

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And the Offense is allowed to hold onto the ball and not throw seeing eye INTs. If they had actually performed semi-competently, the defense wouldn't have been in a position to give up two TDs. Also, you think I'm saying the Defense was physically tired from just this game? The Offense has been so damned incompetent for 4 to 5 games that the Defense has been trying to carry the team. Yeah, they were tired in the first half. Tired from trying to pull their weight and part of the Offense's too.

Y'all keep trying this red herring crap like folks are talking about one half. We're talking about weeks worth of accumulation of picking up extra slack because the Offense is **** right now. THAT kind of effort takes a toll; physically and mentally.
 
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