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Fire Tomlin

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MB47

Well-known member
Can you imagine AR sitting down with a true football man watching every play of the Steelers last few seasons and getting their honest opinions on the bullshitter coaching our team ?
 

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Fiji Mariner

Well-known member
Can we bring back Munch as a HC please!!!

Our OL has went from Filet to trash to straight dumpster fire...in desperate need of coaching and attitude, he has the potential to fix both.

Offer him 24/7 use of the team jet, but him a house, back up the Brinks truck....whatever it takes
 

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suncitysteel

Well-known member
Can we bring back Munch as a HC please!!!

I think we're all aware that great coordinators/position coaches don't always translate to great HCs. Munchak's record as Titans HC was 22-26 over three seasons with no playoff appearances. No thanks. Now, returning as OL coach? Heck yes, but he left for Denver for family and for no other reason, so I don't think he's going anywhere anytime soon.
 

str8liner

Well-known member
In situations like this teams never do it but its best to nuke the whole thing and start from scratch. HC has a vision, brings in other coaches he likes with the same vision, they bring in players they think fit their system and so on.

What you got with Tomlin now is a never ending carousel of coach's getting hired and canned. Am I correct in saying that the only coach who has been hired under Tomlin the last 10 years who made an improvement was Munchak?

Somethings got to change.
 

SteelerFan448

Well-known member
What you got with Tomlin now is a never ending carousel of coach's getting hired and canned. Am I correct in saying that the only coach who has been hired under Tomlin the last 10 years who made an improvement was Munchak?
Are you talking a coaching getting hired away from the Steelers getting a promotion? It was a lateral move when Munchak left for the Broncos. Or are you referring to his positional unit performing well after Tomlin hired him?
 

str8liner

Well-known member
Are you talking a coaching getting hired away from the Steelers getting a promotion? It was a lateral move when Munchak left for the Broncos. Or are you referring to his positional unit performing well after Tomlin hired him?
Actually improving whatever position he/they were hired to fix. I know the reasons behind him leaving.
 

Black & Gold Bleeder

Well-known member
I think our defensive backfield coaching has improved. They cant draft very well. Sutton is their success, and hes not shut down. Mike Hilton, Pierre both UDFA's. Fitz, traded for. Joe H. Signed from cleveland.

I also think our D line coach does a good job.
 

diver

Well-known member
I can't stand Mark Madden, but I think he is right when he says it is cultural more than anything. I think if you fix that, everything else begins to look better. For example, maybe they have to reevaluate the guys they draft. Do they love football? Do they have mentalities beyond your basic 15 year old? Perhaps for a while if the talent between one guy and another is at least relatively close, they draft the guy who is more mature and loves the game. Stop going for athletic freaks who lack maturity.

They need a lot more Heywards and a lot less Claypools.
 

SteelerFan448

Well-known member
Actually improving whatever position he/they were hired to fix. I know the reasons behind him leaving.
I think more than Munchak has done a good job. Dunbar does good work with the defensive line. They've had some quality RB and WR coaches over the years. I believe Teryl Austin made a positive impact early on. Jerry Olsavsky has done good work with the ILBs over the years. What we haven't seen are any innovators and apparently strong leaders on the coaching staff. It is remarkable none of these guys have been tagged for a promotion let alone a head coaching job around the NFL. I also believe the Steelers have the smallest coaching staff in the league.
I can't stand Mark Madden, but I think he is right when he says it is cultural more than anything. I think if you fix that, everything else begins to look better. For example, maybe they have to reevaluate the guys they draft. Do they love football? Do they have mentalities beyond your basic 15 year old? Perhaps for a while if the talent between one guy and another is at least relatively close, they draft the guy who is more mature and loves the game. Stop going for athletic freaks who lack maturity.

They need a lot more Heywards and a lot less Claypools.
There is some cultural problems in the sense I don't think the veterans are prepping the young guys like they used to. It doesn't feel like they play for each other. Troy's Hall of Fame speech nailed what it meant to be a Steeler. It doesn't feel that way right now. However, the bigger issue is a talent issue. How many guys on this roster right now would start for an average team in the league? Heyward, Watt, Minkah...is there anyone else? Maybe Johnson as a No. 2 or 3 receiver and Freiermuth & Harris as reserves. That's about it.

We are trotting out backup level players at 3 of 5 offensive line spots, 2 of 3 defensive line positions, 1 of 2 ILB spots, and at nickel back...and a bottom third QB. That's 8 of 22 starters playing below average level, 2 elite talents, 1 very good talent, 2 young guys with potential, and 9 guys playing average football.
 

diver

Well-known member
I think more than Munchak has done a good job. Dunbar does good work with the defensive line. They've had some quality RB and WR coaches over the years. I believe Teryl Austin made a positive impact early on. Jerry Olsavsky has done good work with the ILBs over the years. What we haven't seen are any innovators and apparently strong leaders on the coaching staff. It is remarkable none of these guys have been tagged for a promotion let alone a head coaching job around the NFL. I also believe the Steelers have the smallest coaching staff in the league.

There is some cultural problems in the sense I don't think the veterans are prepping the young guys like they used to. It doesn't feel like they play for each other. Troy's Hall of Fame speech nailed what it meant to be a Steeler. It doesn't feel that way right now. However, the bigger issue is a talent issue. How many guys on this roster right now would start for an average team in the league? Heyward, Watt, Minkah...is there anyone else? Maybe Johnson as a No. 2 or 3 receiver and Freiermuth & Harris as reserves. That's about it.

We are trotting out backup level players at 3 of 5 offensive line spots, 2 of 3 defensive line positions, 1 of 2 ILB spots, and at nickel back...and a bottom third QB. That's 8 of 22 starters playing below average level, 2 elite talents, 1 very good talent, 2 young guys with potential, and 9 guys playing average football.
You may be right. I'm not sure, though. On paper anyway, Claypool, with his measurables, should be a #1 WR. He isn't. The talent is there. So what is holding him back? That is where I wonder if culture comes in.
 

diver

Well-known member
I guess the question is in today's society can a team take a young, arrogant kid who has had his ass sniffed since he was about 6 years old and has the mentality of a 15 year old and grow him up?

I doubt this present coaching staff can. Therefore, if Tomlin stays, which is pretty much a given, they'd better reevaluate how they draft and start going after guys who have more maturity even if they have a little less talent.
 

SteelerFan448

Well-known member
You may be right. I'm not sure, though. On paper anyway, Claypool, with his measurables, should be a #1 WR. He isn't. The talent is there. So what is holding him back? That is where I wonder if culture comes in.
I don't know if that's culture or if his negatives entering the NFL are still there. There were concerns with his route running and ability to separate. He's always been inconsistent with contested balls. I don't get the impression he put much work in during the offseason to improve in those areas. I don't know if that's culture or the lack of self motivation. What the Steelers don't have is a veteran receiver like Hines Ward who is working with the young guys during camp and practice to improve their game. The guy that should be doing it self-imploded and has missed more games than he's played since forcing his way out of Pittsburgh.
 

Ron Burgundy

Well-known member
I don't know if that's culture or if his negatives entering the NFL are still there. There were concerns with his route running and ability to separate. He's always been inconsistent with contested balls. I don't get the impression he put much work in during the offseason to improve in those areas. I don't know if that's culture or the lack of self motivation. What the Steelers don't have is a veteran receiver like Hines Ward who is working with the young guys during camp and practice to improve their game. The guy that should be doing it self-imploded and has missed more games than he's played since forcing his way out of Pittsburgh.
Stonio had his issues with the chronic but I wonder if any of our WR's practice this?

 

diver

Well-known member
I think one of the ways to improve the culture is to draft more mature guys, if there are any out there anymore. Maybe the veterans are trying to be mentors and the young guys aren't listening.

As has been discussed as it pertains to the draft, the Steelers seem to like to draft younger guys. Maybe they need to get away from that for a couple of years.

I don't know. I know I am old. I just cannot for the life of me figure out how a guy who is on a team that just got blown out thinks the answer to some of the teams problems might be playing music at practice. It isn't even that I'd be against music at practice, as I never really gave it much thought. But he has, which is telling in it's own right. That's what he thinks about. Not how he can change his work to get better, but music.
 

Steelr4evr

Well-known member
I think one of the ways to improve the culture is to draft more mature guys, if there are any out there anymore. Maybe the veterans are trying to be mentors and the young guys aren't listening.

As has been discussed as it pertains to the draft, the Steelers seem to like to draft younger guys. Maybe they need to get away from that for a couple of years.

I don't know. I know I am old. I just cannot for the life of me figure out how a guy who is on a team that just got blown out thinks the answer to some of the teams problems might be playing music at practice. It isn't even that I'd be against music at practice, as I never really gave it much thought. But he has, which is telling in it's own right. That's what he thinks about. Not how he can change his work to get better, but music.


I'm pretty sure Chuck Noll said if I have to motivate you,I'll cut you.
 

Black & Gold Bleeder

Well-known member
Interesting topic @ Diver. A young man who has been gifted athleticly all his life. Never had to "work for it". Its always been about his intro music ,,, (speculation)

Take another guy like Kendrick Green. Maybe not "gifted" as an athlete, but enough to be the right size . Take into account his age, and coming out early in the draft, going up against more mature men, and the giant talent jump from college. I think he will be ok and be a starter at guard or center. He was a 3rd round pick and. was coming out early. I think he will be fine but it doesnt help us RIGHT NOW.

As nutty as AB is /was. That guy came in with the talent he had as a late round pick and made something of himself with hard work.
 

Steelr4evr

Well-known member
I guess the question is in today's society can a team take a young, arrogant kid who has had his ass sniffed since he was about 6 years old and has the mentality of a 15 year old and grow him up?

I doubt this present coaching staff can. Therefore, if Tomlin stays, which is pretty much a given, they'd better reevaluate how they draft and start going after guys who have more maturity even if they have a little less talent.

Even worse is when you have that and instantly make him rich and give him some fame.
 

topseed

Well-known member
I don't know if that's culture or if his negatives entering the NFL are still there. There were concerns with his route running and ability to separate. He's always been inconsistent with contested balls. I don't get the impression he put much work in during the offseason to improve in those areas. I don't know if that's culture or the lack of self motivation. What the Steelers don't have is a veteran receiver like Hines Ward who is working with the young guys during camp and practice to improve their game. The guy that should be doing it self-imploded and has missed more games than he's played since forcing his way out of Pittsburgh.
But I noticed that Claypool did find the time to film a Therabody commercial during the offseason. There's that.
 

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